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1989 Ford F-250 Pick-up Stalling - Fuel System
Question: We just rebuilt the engine in the truck. When we start it, it idles fine but when its put in any gear, it stalls. before this it ran bad but we replaced the fuel relay and ran injector cleaner and took out the injectors and recleaned them. it would just stall and the brake light and battery light was coming on.
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Technican: 5-18-03.
The man said the cam is not in mechanical time with the crank. He is certain of that.
When you get your engine started, adjust the timing so as to have power, then shut the engine off and find that, now, it won't start... It is because the cam is far enough out of time that there is no compression when the spark fires. It's not going to start. When compression does occur, the spark just isn't there at the right time.
It is suggested that you open the front cover and retime the cam to the crank.
Owner: the comp cam is ground 4 degrees advanced and I put an elderbrok timing chain and it said in the directions on the timing chain that ford ground thier cams on the retarded side and that timing chain was sopposed to put the cam straight up but I am thinking that with the comp cam and that timing chain it may be 8 degrees advanced. what do you think, this is all I can think that could through the timing off and even that shouldnt mess it up I figure.
Thanks
Technican: 5-16-03.
Tomorrow morning I will see, who I believe to be, an excellent Ford technician in your behalf. Man I hope he can help. If nothing triggers a thought immediately, he'll have a copy of our discussion to review so he can call me when a suggestion comes to mind.
I'll keep you informed/updated.
Technican: 4-27-03. Hello, how well does the engine rev up, respond to quick changes in throttle? Does it seem to be powerful and healthy? If so, is there reason to suspect a transmission problem stalling the engine?
What is the idle speed of the engine? Will it stall if you first increase the idle speed by 200rpm and then put the truck in gear? Can you start the truck rolling and, with the engine running at idle, put it in gear and drive on?
Please advise...I'll try to help.
Owner: The transmission works fine, the idle speed depending on where I put the timing is good. Now I can drive it, its not doing the putting in gear and stall thing but my timing if I put it at 10 degrees advanced with the jumper off it goes to 30 degrees advanced at any RPM and it wont start but if I leave the jumper off, set the timing 20 to 25 degrees it will start good and takes off quick but as soon as it gets to about 3000 RPM's it starts missing really bad. and if I put the jumper in, it goes to 60 degrees advanced even at an idle but it dont miss all the way up to 5 or 6000 RPm but real sluggish at taking off. If I try to run the timing at 30 degrees with the jumper out it will idle for a few minutes but stall and when I start it up after it stalls the exhaust smokes a little bit.
Technican: Please tell me which engine (? LITRE) we are working on here so I can get on track..
Technican: 5-2-03. Please, I need to hear from you, is this query resolved?
Owner: i SENT AN ANSWER TO YOUR EMAIL BUT YOU MUST NOT HAVE GOTTEN IT. tHE MOTOR IS A 5.8 FUEL ENJECTED. if I set the timing at factory 10 degrees advanced as soon as its shut off it wont start it justs cranks and sounds like it isnt firing. but if I advance it to 20 or 25 degrees, thats with that short out plug being out. it is real sluggish taking off but it will reave up to 5 or 6 thousand rpm. when its set at factory at 10 degrees it seems peppier on the low end but misses a little but it wont reave over 3500 or 4000 rpm. and while its idling with the timing at 25 degrees it will idle a minute and it seems like it starts to miss and the miss gets stronger and then dies like the key was turned off. but it will start back up and it will do it all over again. but the only way I can drive it is with it 25 degrees advanced. with the plug in its probobly around 40 to 60 degrees advanced.
Technican: 5-2-03. Thank you, I did not get your previous message. If you sent it to my personal e-mail my firewall probably intercepted it.
I keep wondering if the distributor is installed just one gear tooth off? The engine would usually start but would be a fuss to time properly. If timing the engine is done by design, and the engine doesn't run well when you pull the short out plug, a recheck of the assembly basics is in order.
If indeed the distributor is off one tooth, consider where the valves are in mechanical revolution cycle when the plug fires. Low power is easily a result due to the possibility of valves not fully closed in time for maximum power when the fuel combustion is peaked.
Let me know what you think?
Owner: I had number one cylinder top dead center and I put number one cylinder pointing to the back of the motor. thats where ford shows it going. but it doesnt matter where the distributer is at or where the rotor is pointing as long as you start # 1 cylinder there. and continue the firing order from there. I put Chevys together and when I went to start it, it was 180 out and instead of pulling out the distributor I just started my firing order 180 out and they ran fine. Im just wondering if it could be the oxygen sensor because when its idling and goes to stall, it acts like its running really really rich.
Unless fords are differant, I havent worked that much on Fords.
At least
Technican: 5-2-03.
Does the check engine light remain on? Can you get your hands on a scanner that will track O2 Sensor performance?
I'll do some research tomorrow and see if anything pops up and get back to you soon as I can.
I don't believe Ford is different/unique compared to Chevy in the areas of discussion we are having, either.
I have thirty years auto experience and I'll never profess to know it all. I learn all the time. I want to learn by helping you, too.
Owner: I went down this morning and paid $70 to have it put on a scanner. and all they could find was it was saying the short out plug for the distributer was bad. they think that was a fluke because they checked it and it was working fine. The truck stalled there three times. other than that it showed nothing. so I decided to stop at auto zone on the way home, they have a hand held and it brought up code 85 and (111 which they couldnt find out) and 11 which is the end of scan. 85 was a bad connection in the canister purge cylinoid and I replaced that.
The check engine light has not come on but the bulb might be blowed.
still nothing. but code 85 also said it might be a problem with the ECM module, so I bought one at Advance Parts and bought the EEC module relay on the fender well and with a new one in there it wont even start, but if I put the old one back in, it starts. I took it back in and got another one, it still did the same thing. I even tried changing the timing, it fires a little but wont start with the new one. So I am now getting ready to disconnect the battery, clear the computer and try the new module to see if that works. but even the guy who put the scanner on it couldnt figure out why they had to set the timing at 25 degrees (which I had to change on the way home to about 28 to get it to run to get home) to get it to even reave up. the fuel pressure was at 40 pounds and vaccuum was at 20 inches. So I am still at a loss.
Thanks for any help. I have racked my brain to figure it out.
Technican: 5-3-03.
Good grief, I'm stunned! If I could just get my hands on this truck they would talk to me. I would be looking for a loose, missing, or, dirty ground connection, I would restab the distributor (just because), I'd look at the fuel injector harness to make certain there are no transposals in connections and I'd wonder if the crank and cam are in perfect time... and I'd take a look at the ignition coil output in Kvolts.
Then I'd put a dent in it deep enough to park the new truck I brought home when I had told my wife I was just going to Wal-Mart for some Alpo for the dog!
I'll get back to you, you went beyond the research I had time for today. When I have another idea, I'll check in with you.
Technican: 5-17-03.
I did see my friend today, handed him a copy of our discussion and asked for help. Turns out that, today, he was a sponsor at a local car show and venders to visitors were his priority. He said for me to call him tomorrow afternoon and he could give us his opinion. I trust him. I will call.
Tomorrow, Sir! Thanks for your patience,
Technican: 5-7-03.
Any news on this situation?
Owner: situation is the same. I spent 40.00 for an oxygen sensor hoping its that but no luck.
Technican: 5-7-03.
Man-o-man, I've got to have coffee with some guys I know and brain storm for some help.
The dude I really want to see won't be around until Saturday the 17th of this month.
More as soon as I can..
Owner: appreciate any help. at end of wits. dont know what else to do.
Technican: 5-13-03.
Hi, I've not forgotten you and I am not giving up. Just wanted you to know I'll see an excellent Ford tech this Saturday (he is out of town). I have printed our discussion for his review and hope he can offer something we can use. Thanks for your patience. Here's How To Get Guaranteed Solutions In Minutes
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