1989 Ford Thunderbird Won't Start - Electrical & Lighting Systems

Question: I am at a loss. To give the quick version of the problem. Several months ago I pulled into a gas station for fuel. When I went to restart the car it was completely dead. Not even any clicking. I tried over and over, then suddenly it starts. Ok that was weird but we're running now so no biggie. A couple months go bye the car is running fine I park it for the evening. The next morning it's completely dead. It had enough juice to make the starter relay click rapidly. I tried to jump it and nothing. I tried byesassing the relay thinking it was bad, nothing. Then out of the blue it finally starts, I have no idea what I accidentaly did. It drove to work fine. When I went to go home it would not start, no juice. I tried a couple more times then it worked. So that night I replaced the battery thinking that was the problem. It worked for a couple days then the same thing happened. Late for work again=0| This time I accidentaly arced the two posts on the starter relay and it cranked the engine. So I replaced the relay and have not had any problems for a few months until yesterday(Monday) Same symptoms before work. Would not jump start. This time arcing the relay wouldn't do it. Later in the evening I tried monkeying with it again. Nothing. I put some jumpers to it from my other car and let it try to build a charge for about 20 min. Then it started. I thought great I can go to work in the morning. Wrong! This morning it was completely dead again. Not even enough juice to lock the doors. There is definatly a draw or something that is causing the issue that I can't find. Have you heard of such problems with this model? Do you have any suggestions of what I can do next? Anything will help. Thank you. Thayne Hymas

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Technican: from your multiple symtoms I believe you have a bad starter and it has been going out since the solenoid has been just clicking, that starter has to be replaced. the other thing is your battery it has been destroyed because of the other problems which is why it will not hold a good charge replace the batt and starter+solenoid and you will be back in the car I hope this helps

Owner: I am not in a position to just through money at the car in hopes that it will cure my problem. I don't doubt your knowledge, please don't take this wrong. Is there a way that I can perform some sort of test that will verifie that before I go buying parts.

Technican: yes you can have the batt bench tested at an auto parts storebut sometimes the batt will check out fine on the bench and act different in the car. the starter also can be tested by see how many cranking amps are being drawn while starting and if the solenoid operates does the starter engage? your whole electrical sys can be tested for free at a batt/alternator shop

Owner: Thank you for your continued help. If the starter is bad, why would that drain the system entirely? Like I said in my initial email there isn't even enough juice to lock the doors. Is it possible that the cables from the battery to the starter are shot and causing the problem? I would hope that the battery place would tell me if that were so.

Technican: It is possible that a startercan put such a load on a battery that it burns out cells and a battery can actually go dead and not hold a full charge again as for it not having enough power for doors or lights you wopuld want to clean the batt posts, use baking soda and water or coca a cola then see if you have juice back

Owner: The battery posts are clean. I just replaced the battery less than a year ago. Obviously I am really confused. I am trying to get as much info as I can so I can fix the problem and hopfully not run into the issue again. Is it possible that this could have damaged my alternator and maybe this is part of the charging issue?

Technican: no I do not think it damaged your alternator but it is possible that the alt was bad before the problems started lets go from scratch I will walk you through you say the posts are clean now have your batt testesed at an auto parts store and we will go from there

Owner: Itested the battery with a volt meter last night. I had a little more than 8 volts. I hooked up to my wives car and got it to 12. I did notice that my posotive cable was a bit loose and cracked so it wouldn't tighten. Once the battery was charged up, i tried to start it like I did before, only this time it cranked over once then had a horrible almost gridiing sound and stopped then you could hear the solonoid clicking. A couple tries at that and the entire system was shot again. I also heard almost like an arcing sound coming from the manifold area. I don't know if it was anything though or if in fact that is the area it was coming from.

Technican: ok check the batt cable going to the engine it is the chassis ground for a good connection and you may want to be sure of those connections at the batt if the post is cracked replace it. a arc at the batt could cause an explosion of the batt that will taake your hood off I speak from experience.

Owner: good morning. Ok, last night I replaced the posotive cable from the batt to the relay. It seemed to help a bit in at least getting the battery to charge. I finally was able to get the car jump started. I drove around for a while until about 11 pm last night hoping the batt would charge. This morning at 7am I had nothing. I did have more juice than before, but not enough to do anything. I did a gravity check on the battery and all 6 cells were more or less water. I kinda hope that this whole prob is just a faulty batt even though it is relativly new. The question though is do I have a problem that is frying my batt? Whats next after the new batt?

Technican: you can test your alternator by getting the car started and removing the positive batt cable fro0m the batt if the car shuts off then the alternator is bad. It is probly the batt dieng overnight that is common I would have it tested or replaced

Owner: once I replace the battery, if the alternator is bad, how long will it take to find out. Is it possible I could go for a month and then all the sudden my battery fails and would have to buy a new one along with an alternator? Is it common to have a batt less than a year old go bad, or does something else cause it?

Technican: imeadiatly while the car is running disconect the pos batt cable and see if the car continues to run or shuts off

Owner: Ok, I put the new battery in. As soon as the car fired up(immediatly=0))I took the pos cable off. The car continued to run for at least half an hour before I shut it off. I did notice that when the car was running, if I touched the cable to the post, it would seem to draw the engine down a bit. Nothing big, just kinda like it slowed the idle down. Maybe thats normal or maybe I don't know what I'm talking about. Either way, new batt and the car runs. Do you think that I just bought a faulty battery or would you reccomend that I check out some other areas to make sure there are no problems causing the batt to fail?

Technican: yes it sounds like you are headed in the right direction now you need to keep a good ear out for when you start the car listen for starter whinning or clicks or hesitations, your alternator is good and it is common for the idle change when replacing the cable so that is ok you need to get an ampmeter and make sure everything is off in the car disconect the batt cable and put the ammeter in series with the car engine circuit and see if there is a draw or take it to a alternator shop to have it tested for a draw so you can see if something was indeed pulling power while you slept.

Owner: Thanks for all your help. It's been great.

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1989 Ford Thunderbird Won't Start - Electrical & Lighting Systems

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